Utterly Mad
The Pit => Last Man Gaming => Topic started by: saltmummy626 on July 25, 2015, 02:30:54 am
-
So... Does anyone here play or once played Haven and Hearth? If you don't know what im talking about: http://www.havenandhearth.com/portal/
I used to actually call in sick to work to play this game. Next month its getting upgraded to 2.5D graphics and getting its first real update in ages. Is a good game and is completely free last time I checked. I just hope they don't make this new version like their other game, Salem. *shudder* absolute garbage.
Fun fact, that little banner in my sig? the black one with the deer skull on it? It's the sigil of my village, Gulgatha. Even after all this time of not playing it, Gulgatha still holds a very special place in my mind.
-
Its funny I haven't played HavenandHearth in a while, but it hasn't really left my mind. The game (with all its ripped sounds and assets) has some real charm to it, and reminds me of a 2D more slow burning version of Rust.
But the main thing I both loathe and love about the game is the skill system, its a really neat idea to get new skills to help you really feel like you're progress, but the problem is that you get EXP from discovering or making new things, so when you spend your current XP on something that seems useful in the short term but not in the long term. Its like what Yahtzee said about System Shock 2's skill system, you didn't think that leveling up your trouser skill would be useful until you get to the angry pants section that you realize that you should've been pumping points into that all along.
But I started playing when ProJared released his video about it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K6fIyvNvpXU
Me and my sister made a small encampment near a river and a few "dead" people, everything was going great until a boar showed up. Neither of us had a point in fighting/hunting so we ended up getting gored by it.
-
Man I remember Haven and Hearth. I also remember having a small group of forumers with me when we played. I suddenly stopped playing, and I think they did too. We made friends with a small village and I also remember looting an abandoned house. I think I am still friends with that guy on Skype.
-
My downfall with haven was a pretty slow agonized thing. Basically there comes a point when the game seems more like chores and less like fun, and then you see a stranger nearby and all those chores are suddenly threatened. Your friends stop showing up or they won't help out with certain things (making steel) and everything seems to become a task you do by yourself. The game is fun alone, but gets boring quick if you dislike repetition. Playing with others is much better, but you better be sure those you are playing with are your friends/can be trusted. Recruiting new villagers can lead to a swift and disheartening downfall if you aren't careful. School made me distrust people, H&H tripled those feelings.
I still love it.
A lot of the tedium is being mitigated in this new version apparently.
-
Maybe we should make an Utterly Mad group village.
Interest check: Would anyone want to play with us?
-
I would. I wouldn't be able to be on every day, but it seems like a neat game.
-
Id prolly be interested. I'd bring two other people with me.
-
Alright sounds like enough people to start a settlement and forumers can join in.
-
I would perhaps be interested. I'll check it out in a little while if I don't forget to.
-
Ok how about in the ruin of my old little settlement and we can rebuild it? It's hard to find a nice clear space and the place we had was great, and close to a large settlement which last time I played were really nice and helped us a lot and looks like their walls are still up so they are still active. (Unless the village was invaded. D:)
My hearth secret is
Completely and Utterly Mad
you use this to join at the same area, you give this secret to the guy in the starting zone close to the ladder.
Vulnus, Lorknis, and Devilranger where the original few if you want to join us again. We still have some stuff on us, but mostly everything has worn away, even a lot of the pathing.
Well shit is seems someone claimed a random bit of the area. >:( that is obnoxious.
-
Speaking of ruined holdings, I have an intact iron mine. last I checked it was still untouched. before I quit I pumped so much LP into the underground claim stake that there was no way a village claim could be laid over it. Its underground too so the stake doesn't decay and any attempt to dig into it would result in a lot of damage.
[edit] pff. nevermind, its been taken and turned into a public mine.
-
Well atleast its public.
-
Im being sucked back in, halp. D: NO! MAH FREE TIME!
I decided to throw together a house for the conveniance of utterly mad hearthlings. Upon attempting to build the house I see the message "It will be 3 days for the building site to set." when the fuck did this shit happen? I guess its to prevent abuse, but still...
-
sorry for the double post, but im bumping this and its my thread so beh.
H&H 2.0 has been pushed back to the 28th of this month.
That being said, who wants to join me under the banner of Gulgatha? Normally I don't recruit, but I feel that utterly mad is populated with people I think I can trust and I can forgo my usual neurotic paranoia concerning its denizens.
What can Gulgatha offer me?
A place where you can play H&H with others. Maybe not free from danger (the hearthlands are filled with dickheads after all) but no one in Gulgatha is going to treat you like shit.
What can I offer Gulgatha?
Your mortal soul. I mean... your pleasant conversation and jolly cooperation.
What are the rules?
very simple, no theft from others in the village. anything you don't want to share, you keep in your house (once we have them set up) the rest of it is public. murder is off limits. If you plan on committing any crimes out in the hearthlands, make sure the proper channels are set up to keep the inevitable rangers off our doorstep. Two different iterations of Gulgatha were lost because villagers didn't bother to evade trackers. Thats pretty much it really.
What is Gulgatha's policy on raids?
Generally, we don't do them simply because the risk is large. Exceptions have been made on several occasions, the circumstances of which involved another village digging too deep and into Gulgatha controlled mines. On that occasion we salted the other village and made it utterly unusable and our scents unaccessable.
What was that about public goods?
Gulgatha has a policy of making materials publicly available to any and all. Try to use common sense so that materials are not wasted though. If you want a metal saw, but don't have the best skill in metal working, its probably best you not make the saw yourself.
What job should I take?
Doesn't matter. In Gulgatha, you do what you want. This does mean that we do go hungry from time to time though when no one feels like hunting.
What about life insurance?
The most you can expect is that Gulgatha will go to great lengths to retrieve your body should you die so that it can be buried on Gulgathan lands.
Can I get a key to the gate?
No. All keys are to be left with Gulgatha's licensed key alt, Vedetta.
What if I want to leave?
Go ahead. We will not stop you. That being said, once a Gulgathan always a Gulgathan. Unless you were banished for some act of high treachery, you can expect to be welcomed back with open arms should you decide to return.
Shouldn't this have it's own thread?
Probably...
Any questions should be directed to me either here, or via PM on the H&H forums. My username is that same there as it is here. saltmummy626.
-
2.0? i might finally start playing, the 28th is my birthday too. Seems like a fun game, i was just completely unmotivated to learn all summer. i will play it.
-
2.0? i might finally start playing, the 28th is my birthday too. Seems like a fun game, i was just completely unmotivated to learn all summer. i will play it.
Beware this game is a total time sink.
-
2.0? i might finally start playing, the 28th is my birthday too. Seems like a fun game, i was just completely unmotivated to learn all summer. i will play it.
Beware this game is a total time sink.
Indeed! I called in sick twice back when I first started playing it just so I could keep playing.
-
2.0? i might finally start playing, the 28th is my birthday too. Seems like a fun game, i was just completely unmotivated to learn all summer. i will play it.
Beware this game is a total time sink.
Indeed! I called in sick twice back when I first started playing it just so I could keep playing.
What makes you people think I would have anything better to do?
-
You people make me want to re download Enders client...
Should I?
-
No. Only a couple days left of the game as it is now, just wander around in the default client if you want to see what the game was like before they change the graphics up. It will probably be awhile before Ender or whoever creates a new client for H&H, if they even get a chance to do that. Haven 2.0 might not be "open" like the old version is.
-
Gotcha, can't wait to play with you lot then.
-
OK, I have been informed that H&H 2.0 will probably be open at 5 PM UTC+2. Im not sure what that is in most other regions but im fairly certain its about 10 AM or noon where I live. Everything is almost ready.
Is gon be fun
-
Psyched.
So, how do we find each other?
-
Hearthsecret.
Someone has to join before us, and then give us the hearthsecret. We give it to one of the guys in the starting little area BEFORE spawning, so your hearthfire (Spawn point pretty much.) will be near theirs.
-
So, who's joining up first then?
-
I don't have time tonight, its me birthday and of course I've gotta clean the house and mess around with family until 8pm. After that, mabye.
-
Im going to try and join up as soon as the game is up, the hearth secret is going to be "picter"
here is a link to a countdown http://www.odditown.com/hafen-countdown.html
Also, happy birthday Perigrin. Try to have much funs.
[EDIT]
I have discovered an issue. Looking through a list of changes to the new haven, I see that the devs state "By the by. Teleportation only along formal roads. No hearth secrets. Random wilderness spawns only." which means getting together may be an absolute hassle, unless something else is available. The HS remains, Ill dig around for more info.
-
Could you by chance give us a linksy doodle so that we download the right thing?
-
http://www.havenandhearth.com/portal/
Here you go, but I think im out. its pay to play now apparently. I used to believe I knew what anger was. Apparently I didn't know shit. I hope to fucking god it's another one of their limp dicked jokes. If it is, it will probably be the single greatest troll pulled against me and my group ever.
-
If they are charging for it then they may need the money to continue to update it. There are a number of possible and legitimate reasons to make it a paid format then free to play, though leaving the old one up would have been a good idea if they took it down.
-
They put a pay wall on the old one too. If you don't pay them, you can only play for 12 hours a month after your initial 48 hours are gone.
-
Wait, so you can still play... it's just you can only do 12 hours a month?
That's... not horrible really, considering a lot of things in Haven are just you clicking to do something and then just logging.
-
Nope, not playing that shit for money. I dont have much money, and ehhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.
-
I probably won't either then...
-
Yeah it's confirmed to be a serious thing and not some hard core trolling on the devs part. I don't think it's possible to describe how deeply and profoundly disappointed I am.
-
Its funny watching the fan boys try to give one good reason as to why its "fair". "ITS A BETTER VALUE THEN MOST MMOS!" Really now? You can play WoW for free, and you get a tight level cap, but most of the game is still open to you.
Besides that moot point. Doesn't half the shit in H&H take several days? I remember tanning a bide nearly taking a week to do. So I can play two days for free and get fuckall done in the process? Sure. Sounds like a totally fair trade off.
H&H is tideous and a very niche game, with a tiny userbase. This ain't going to help it grow.
-
As a non fanboy there might be one of numerous legitimate reasons for going to a pay to play format. They may be unable to support development without money, or maybe they want to be able to live somewhere other then mother's basement, or possibly, just maybe, they've finally gotten to a point where they feel justified in asking for some money to be able to play the game fully. I don't get why people are mad, these guys have put a lot of effort into the game from the sounds of it so why not pay some cash if you enjoyed it? Other niche games have done similiar if I recall correctly, so it's not like this is a new thing where a free game went pay to play.
-
Well until the game was released I for one heard nothing of it going to be Pay 2 Win. Lot's of people were excited for the new game, and now we are met with sudden payments to be able to progress at a normal rate.
If they wanted money there is so many better ways to do this; like Kickstarter, Indiegogo, Patreon, etcetera. I know of no tale of a pay 2 win where no one complained about it at all, nor a pay 2 win that was very good or well liked for this feature.
I mean by your logic Vulnus, Dead Space 3 is alright for having Pay 2 Win because they might need the money. For a game like H&H pay 2 win will turn lot's of people off, like a lot of us on this thread actually.
-
As a non fanboy there might be one of numerous legitimate reasons for going to a pay to play format. They may be unable to support development without money, or maybe they want to be able to live somewhere other then mother's basement, or possibly, just maybe, they've finally gotten to a point where they feel justified in asking for some money to be able to play the game fully. I don't get why people are mad, these guys have put a lot of effort into the game from the sounds of it so why not pay some cash if you enjoyed it? Other niche games have done similiar if I recall correctly, so it's not like this is a new thing where a free game went pay to play.
I'm far from a fanboy of Haven and Hearth, as a matter of fact I found the game to be like Farmville with Dwarf Fortress elements. The problem with Haven and Hearth (they did this for balance and "realism") is that you have to wait, a lot, like stupid amounts. Do you know in F2P games where you have that one building that gives you loads of money, but only works in 2-3 days. Well take that idea and apply that to getting something as basic as leather, or smelting ore, or basically anything that's required to get far in the early game.
So they put up a pay wall basically saying you get a few days a month to check your settlement and finally get to play with all that stuff you spent so many hours collecting. This basically means that if you go the Free-to-Play route, you have two days maximum to gather all the supplies you need, and try to get them prepped or hidden away well enough, so that when next month rolls around you can finally play with what you got. But there comes the problem of other players. While you're basically in a month-long coma, you can get murdered, raided, and have your stuff griefed.
So if you don't pay the $10 for your pay-to-win coin (yeah in order to extend your time you can pay $10 bucks for an in-game item that basically lets you have an extended trial period, the idea is to have people in the game trade fuck loads of items with each other to get this "life extension" coins), but why do that when (if you have a subscription, which is $15) you could just raid the trial-boy's home and loot all his shit that way.
I don't give a shit how desperate for money you are, you don't shaft half your fanbase, silence complaints, and just let the people carrying banners in your name keep cheering on. You know what happens on Steam when shit like this happens? Youtubers and press get a hold of it and make you look like something worse then Hitler.
They could've easily warned the community about the impending change, explaining everything, and been open to criticism. Because this exact business practice is what killed their other MMO that was about the Salem Witch Trials or something (it was basically, Sexy Witches the MMO).
The best way to implement some form of subscription fee for Haven&Hearth wouldn't be holding your shit hostage for the rest of the 28 days. It would've been better if they restricted higher levels of tech to paying players, stuff like steelworking, that magic system no one really uses, and mining. Basically the stuff that people with plenty of time and dedication to the game would pay for. While the new players could get a good taste of how the game works for plenty of time, and when they're ready to progress to town/civilized tech and materials. They shell out the $15 bucks a month to enjoy the more sophisticated side of the game, where PVP battles are everywhere, and people operate full kingdoms from their skull throne.
Because getting out of the early nomad stages where you live in a grass shelter, can't hunt, and all you can really do is look at thing to research stuff in order to get some form of progress (which can take minutes, hours, days, or weeks); is a long, long process that requires ridiculous amounts of coordination and cooperation.
Better analogy: The Nomad early stages are like a tutorial, while the town, pvp, kingdom building stuff in the "late game" is like the full game. So allowing people to get far enough to the "Civilized stage" and then making them pay for the game would be more then fair at that point.
-
Okay, chill dudes. First off dead space 3's micro transactions were bull shit, and I'm not saying what they did here isn't, but from everything said we've heard nothing from the side of the devs so they may have a legitimate reason. The difference from the two is that Dead Space you paid 60 bucks for whereas this has been a free game so far. And whilst I don't remember the name I do remember a game that had a very prolonged beta period that went pay to play.
Also pay to play, and pay to win are two very different concepts, thank you very much bubbadoo. Okay this is shit too, just read some of what AJ posted and it is pretty shit and pay to win...
Locking the old version was a really shit move in my opinion, lock the new one and leave the old one would have been a far better strategy. And a lot of what AJ suggested would work, so I'm not saying there weren't better ways to do it, or that they should have done it at all. But for me seeing people complain about game makers who want some money for something they've worked hard on seems kind of...childish? no, but you get the point. They worked hard to make the thing and asking for compensation shouldn't be that big of a deal, though they probably should have used something like patreon or some such rather then this which DOES fuck over most of the fan base.
Either way I'm out, looks like some people are getting mad at me for some reason when I was attempting to have a discussion, but whatever shite happens so I'll just move myself along.
-
As usual I'm going to pop in out of nowhere and agree with Vulnus.
-
I wanna hop on the bandwagon and agree with Vulny too!
-
Knowing Jorb and Loftar, they aren't going to bother with "their side" of it. Even before now, it was obvious that they gave less than a shit what the community thinks of them and even before now, I found them both to be the shittiest people Id ever encountered. they made a decent game though.
I know from experience that H&H requires a sizable time sink, as quiet a few simple tasks take quiet a bit of time. That being said, from what I've read, a lot of the quick and simple tasks were given a time rework. fishing for example. catching fish before was a fairly simple task that required about thirty minutes to catch enough fish to last a single person about a day or two or in game work, if they didn't drink any water or use any stamina recovery methods outside of natural recovery. (drinking water, sitting in chairs) Fishing in haven 2 takes a long time, even when fishing in good fish spots, you will be lucky to catch anything in half an hour.
In the old game, if you wanted to forage, it would usually take a sizable portion of your time. about a half an hour to fill your inventory with the things you actually wanted at a low skill level. hunting also takes time, more so if you're skills are low and the animal you are after is dangerous, and that food won't last long if you decide to go for making sausage so you can raise your stats. to get that sausage grinder though, you need hard metal. forget the massive hassle of testing cave walls or trying to use rust root to find a mine. the simple task of mining (which I did a huge amount of) requires long stretches of time and ungodly amounts of food. it takes, depending on the hardness of the wall, about a minute to get one unit of stone or ore from a wall. each wall USUALLY has 3 to 5 bits of material in it. I would dig around for something like two hours at a time as long as the food kept coming. when the food ran out, Id have to stop mining and start hunting. (this is with a village at my back btw)
I don't even know why im talking about all this. In a very round about way, I guess im saying that H&H gets pretty goddamn tedious, and while I once really liked it, Im not paying for tedium. They do need money, but I don't have it, and I certainly wouldn't pay for something under this payment model even if I did. I wish I'd known about it BEFORE my hype boner had ice water dumped on it.
-
Its a Subscription, right? I would pay a One Time Fee, but im not paying 15 bucks a month for that shit.
-
yeah, its sub. you can play for free, but only for 12 hours a month. if you pay them 15$, you can play for 24 hours a month AND get access to the old game for as long as they keep it around.
or you can buy subscription packages, the cheapest being 10$ for 30 days and the most expensive being 300$ for 365 days.
Also they are selling hats.
[edit]
There's been a change, you can now play for 7 hours a week. It's better, but it's still not good.